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  • Question for Cabinet Installers.

    When connecting the high end base or upper cabinets together, do most use just regular countersink #6, #8 #10 screws or cabinet connects as shown below? The cabinets are constructed with 3/4" maple veneer on all sides.

    Cabinet Connectors.jpg
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  • #2

    Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

    Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

    I use those - although smaller and more discrete ones.


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    Tim

    www.timbowdin.com

    'If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem'

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    • #3

      Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

      Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

      Most cabs I've seen were simply screwed... Possibly with cup washers. I've never seen those connectors myself.

      Highest quality ones I've personally been involved with used fast caps...

      Peel and stick covers in veneer... We would spray them to match if required... And use a special drill bit to countersink them.



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      • #4

        Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

        Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

        I just use 1 1/4 inch screws and cover the ends with maple fast caps. Frank, as you know, My cabinets are made of the same material as yours.

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        • #5

          Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

          Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

          I've always called them Chicago Bolts and I've never used them for kitchen or bath cabinets but I have used them for knockdown type stuff like book shelves and furniture grade entertainment units.

          The only trouble with them is the care it takes to drill the required holes generally through expensive veneer panels. One bad blow out and you're screwed. I won't risk that on a kitchen during an install. However if you pre drill the cabinets all in precisely the same place [top and bottom corners] they will work just fine.
          "Do it Right!"

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          • #6

            Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

            Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

            The ones I use are from Hafele and require a 5mm hole.

            sleeve connectors.jpg

            I generally just clamp the cabinets together and drill through both with a backer block. Don't think Ive had a blowout yet. I like the fact that they hold from both sides. The head is less obtrusive than a robertson one. I use the fastcap screws and the countersink drill bit for the wall fixings. Because I generally use prefinished maple ply for carcases Ive found the best match for the caps is to take prefinished maple edge tape, iron it on to a scrap board, heat it again and pull it off. That leaves almost all of the glue web on the board. I apply fastcap double sided tape to the strip and use the hole punch cutter to punch out exact sized fast caps that are almost invisible when countersunk.
            Cheers

            Tim

            www.timbowdin.com

            'If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem'

            Comment

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            • #7

              Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

              Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

              Thank you everyone for your reply,

              Based on everyone's reply it sounds as though the "Cabinet Connectors" are overkill? I have someone coming in a week to measure for 3cm granite and was told that if the counters aren't level, strong enough, or secured together properly, they have the option to not measure for a template. Second trip will cost an additional $300.00 to measure due to me not being completely ready. The same holds true when they install the granite counter top.

              Also I'm told 3cm granite (no sub top) is fairly heavy compared to 2cm (with 1/2" sub top) so the counters have to be able to not only support the weight but not shift especially in the area of any seams.

              I'm looking for the strongest method of attaching them together.

              Is the condenses to just go with #8, 1 1/4" countersunk screws

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              • #8

                Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                Originally posted by Tim in Milton View Post
                The ones I use are from Hafele and require a 5mm hole.

                [ATTACH=CONFIG]77234[/ATTACH]

                I generally just clamp the cabinets together and drill through both with a backer block. Don't think Ive had a blowout yet. I like the fact that they hold from both sides. The head is less obtrusive than a robertson one. I use the fastcap screws and the countersink drill bit for the wall fixings. Because I generally use prefinished maple ply for carcases Ive found the best match for the caps is to take prefinished maple edge tape, iron it on to a scrap board, heat it again and pull it off. That leaves almost all of the glue web on the board. I apply fastcap double sided tape to the strip and use the hole punch cutter to punch out exact sized fast caps that are almost invisible when countersunk.
                Nice idea Tim. Well done.
                "Do it Right!"

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                • #9

                  Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                  Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                  Remind the granite guys who the customer is or tell them to take a hike. Some of those Prima Donna jerks like to think they're God's gift to the cabinet industry. I've seen them screw up more than anyone else when it comes to kitchens and all they want is a way out of a warranty and any GD excuse they can try will work for them. I've yet to see a cabinet installation cause granite to fail. After all it's Rock and although it's heavy it's also strong and regardless of anything else it will have support at the back of the cabinet and also at the front which will be a span of less then 22 inches in most cases.
                  "Do it Right!"

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                  • #10

                    Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                    Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                    I agree Rusty, i also like Tim's idea, unfortunately I don't have any of those in stock, I only have screws and cabinet connectors. I think the only real concern they have is where the seam(s) is since I'm wanting only one seam on a U-shapped Kitchen and they're stating that as much as they would like to, based on the Typhoon Bordeau Granite design, it won't match up based as the slab is standard size. They also mentioned with the two seams if the cabinets aren't level and strong, the seam will eventually separate. I say unacceptable, unfortunately they already have the slab and won't give it up to any other fabricator. We've also paid a 40% deposit so I just have to make sure it's as per there standards.

                    Conclusion,

                    I don't want to give them any excuse so I'll probably just go with #8 screws and put a couple extra in, as for the cabinet connectors, I'll just keep them in stock for the next project.
                    Last edited by My Dream; 06-22-2014, 07:55 PM.

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                    • #11

                      Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                      Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                      Originally posted by My Dream View Post
                      They also mentioned with the two seams if the cabinets aren't level and strong, the seam will eventually separate. I say unacceptable, unfortunately they already have the slab and won't give it up to any other fabricator. We've also paid a 40% deposit so I just have to make sure it's as per there standards.

                      Conclusion,

                      I don't want to give them any excuse so I'll probably just go with #8 screws and put a couple extra in, as for the cabinet connectors, I'll just keep them in stock for the next project.
                      If the seam separation is the potential issue then I wouldn't use the screws but the connectors.
                      In order to understand recursion, one must first understand recursion

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                      • #12

                        Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                        Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                        Originally posted by My Dream View Post
                        I agree Rusty, i also like Tim's idea, unfortunately I don't have any of those in stock, I only have screws and cabinet connectors. I think the only real concern they have is where the seam(s) is since I'm wanting only one seam on a U-shapped Kitchen and they're stating that as much as they would like to, based on the Typhoon Bordeau Granite design, it won't match up based as the slab is standard size. They also mentioned with the two seams if the cabinets aren't level and strong, the seam will eventually separate. I say unacceptable, unfortunately they already have the slab and won't give it up to any other fabricator. We've also paid a 40% deposit so I just have to make sure it's as per there standards.

                        Conclusion,

                        I don't want to give them any excuse so I'll probably just go with #8 screws and put a couple extra in, as for the cabinet connectors, I'll just keep them in stock for the next project.
                        You can use any screws that you have available and it wont be the seams that matter. What are you cabinets sitting on??? This is what matters. Are your island or penninsula cabinets bolted bown to the floor?? The wall base cabinets should be fairly secure without bolting down. I use 1 1/8" self CS screws to attach cabinets together and have never had a problem with the granite guys.

                        Comment


                        • #13

                          Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                          Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                          Originally posted by Rusty View Post
                          Remind the granite guys who the customer is or tell them to take a hike. Some of those Prima Donna jerks like to think they're God's gift to the cabinet industry. I've seen them screw up more than anyone else when it comes to kitchens and all they want is a way out of a warranty and any GD excuse they can try will work for them. I've yet to see a cabinet installation cause granite to fail. After all it's Rock and although it's heavy it's also strong and regardless of anything else it will have support at the back of the cabinet and also at the front which will be a span of less then 22 inches in most cases.
                          Agreed


                          Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
                          Cheers

                          Tim

                          www.timbowdin.com

                          'If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem'

                          Comment


                          • #14

                            Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                            Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                            Originally posted by My Dream View Post
                            I agree Rusty, i also like Tim's idea, unfortunately I don't have any of those in stock, I only have screws and cabinet connectors. I think the only real concern they have is where the seam(s) is since I'm wanting only one seam on a U-shapped Kitchen and they're stating that as much as they would like to, based on the Typhoon Bordeau Granite design, it won't match up based as the slab is standard size. They also mentioned with the two seams if the cabinets aren't level and strong, the seam will eventually separate. I say unacceptable, unfortunately they already have the slab and won't give it up to any other fabricator. We've also paid a 40% deposit so I just have to make sure it's as per there standards.

                            Conclusion,

                            I don't want to give them any excuse so I'll probably just go with #8 screws and put a couple extra in, as for the cabinet connectors, I'll just keep them in stock for the next project.
                            I'd give you some but it's on my reorder list and I have less than a dozen. I think they are much more useful for uppers. Screws and a sound base are fine for lowers. They will be using a silicone type bond for the granite. It can easily absorb minor variations in surface height.


                            Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
                            Cheers

                            Tim

                            www.timbowdin.com

                            'If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem'

                            Comment


                            • #15

                              Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                              Re: Question for Cabinet Installers.

                              Originally posted by Tim in Milton View Post
                              I'd give you some but it's on my reorder list and I have less than a dozen. I think they are much more useful for uppers. Screws and a sound base are fine for lowers. They will be using a silicone type bond for the granite. It can easily absorb minor variations in surface height.


                              Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
                              Absolutely agree. Whether you use screws or connector bolts will make no difference at all. Support for the Granite is provided by the vertical wood structure of a cabinet. You will get the absolute same form of structural support from a single cabinet gable as you will from 2 cabinet gables screwed together. Of course 2 gables are stronger than one but I think you can understand the point. It isn't rocket science. You're laying a slab of stone on a square box. Failure is impossible unless the box structure fails. Any cabinet box with a solid back to prevent racking is far more important than the use of screws or bolts and a cabinet box fastened properly to a wall is equally as strong as a solid backed cabinet because the wall becomes the solid back.

                              For example picture a run of cabinets fastened to "U" shaped walls. In this configuration the cabinet CAN NOT rack without very substantial failure including shattered wood. The granite guys are simply trying to project themselves as being more important than they are.
                              "Do it Right!"

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