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  • RV Sam
    started a topic Dead Water Heater

    Dead Water Heater

    GSW Superflew model 6G40NVH-ES-04. 5.5 years old. The only sign of life is one of the 6 leds on the White Rodgers controller is yellow, the B light. In the manual there are over a dozen codes using different combos of the 6 LEDs, but of course None has just the B light on. No hum, no click, not a thing except for the B led on. Unplugged, tried to reset via the 2 temp adjust buttons, nothing. IF the darn thing at least tried to fire i would have a direction to go in but as it is now i am clueless on this. Searching the world wide net i see nothing like this. Any help ? Thanks guys.

  • Lost in the Woods
    replied
    Originally posted by RV Sam View Post
    Lets switch to suana's lol.. I have had one for 30 + years. There is really nothing wrong with an electric unit for the run time they need. Insulate it really well as no need to go to large in sq feet. Line it with a heavy tinfoil material before you put on the ceder. Once heated to the area of 160F with an electric takes less then 30 minutes. Then you go in for 10 minutes. Come out for 10 minutes. In for 10 out for 10, in for 10 and your done. If you open the door and get in and out fast the unit won't kick in that many times. I add water only for the last 3 to 5 minutes as the humidity is going to go from almost none to 99% in seconds and you will think you are going to catch fire, lol. The temp actually drops a little. The ones you can play in that are in hotels etc will not let the heat get high enough to actually have a real sauna bath. They are afraid of people dropping dead. Once you come out on the last session you can roll in the snow or break the ice on your pool and slip in. Best money i ever spent. Anyway, sorry got off topic, if the gas unit and the pipe line is more then an electric unit you'll never recoup your money as it does not run that long.
    While I don't want to steal this thread either Sam, I really appreciate your sauna comments. I may PM or tag you with a future thread I may start on this subject for more insights when I get to the actual build and final decisions which likely will be sometime this summer. I've already got the footings in place and the lumber sitting in my yard and would have gotten to the actual structural build last fall, but winter came fast at us and I chose to finish a small lean-to build I also had on the go instead so I could store my snow blower closer to my driveway rather than drag it from the backyard.

    But in regards to installation costs, my gas is already right near where the sauna will be and I have a gas fitter buddy who I contra other work for that will do it for nothing except for materials costs. Getting another 6/3 line there is possible, and I also have another buddy who is an electrician who also does work for contra for free also, so I could go either way really, but I'm really leaning towards gas.

    Maybe I'll start another thread on this sooner rather than later for my sauna build. I'm in my busy office work season til mid June at the earliest, but I should maybe start lining my ducks up early on this build. Hope you'll join me when I do start that thread, and thanks again for chiming in. I wondered whether anybody here on this forum had done sauna stuff and now I know there is at least one member who has.

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  • RV Sam
    replied
    Lets switch to suana's lol.. I have had one for 30 + years. There is really nothing wrong with an electric unit for the run time they need. Insulate it really well as no need to go to large in sq feet. Line it with a heavy tinfoil material before you put on the ceder. Once heated to the area of 160F with an electric takes less then 30 minutes. Then you go in for 10 minutes. Come out for 10 minutes. In for 10 out for 10, in for 10 and your done. If you open the door and get in and out fast the unit won't kick in that many times. I add water only for the last 3 to 5 minutes as the humidity is going to go from almost none to 99% in seconds and you will think you are going to catch fire, lol. The temp actually drops a little. The ones you can play in that are in hotels etc will not let the heat get high enough to actually have a real sauna bath. They are afraid of people dropping dead. Once you come out on the last session you can roll in the snow or break the ice on your pool and slip in. Best money i ever spent. Anyway, sorry got off topic, if the gas unit and the pipe line is more then an electric unit you'll never recoup your money as it does not run that long.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lost in the Woods
    replied
    Originally posted by John Bartley View Post

    This is what we found also. Instead of the tankless unit, we went with a Rheem,poly tank, super insulated electric unit of 40gal CDN size. This unit had the best energy rating of any electric heater that we could find.
    And that's another good point I failed to mention, gas units are way more efficient than electric units. We have gas for everything we can.

    As clothes dryers are especially nice. Your clothes don't tend to come out blistering hot to the touch almost scorched. The heat from being done with gas I think is a humid heat and doesn't 'cook' your clothes. At least that's what I perceive between the two types of gas and electric dryers.

    I'm looking at installing an outdoor sauna for wifey this summer. Leaning there also heavily to a gas unit versus the much more commonly installed electric sauna heaters. Harder to find gas units, more expensive initially also, but the ongoing heating cost is a lot cheaper, they tend to last a lot longer, and they also take a lot less time to heat up than electric units.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Bartley
    replied
    Originally posted by Lost in the Woods View Post
    There's a lot of tanked units nowadays that are so efficient that they rarely run out of hot water..
    This is what we found also. Instead of the tankless unit, we went with a Rheem,poly tank, super insulated electric unit of 40gal CDN size. This unit had the best energy rating of any electric heater that we could find.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lost in the Woods
    replied
    For a multitude of reasons, and I looked and consulted a lot of pros on this, no tankless for me. They're also not the energy saving devices manufacturers claim they are as well versus tank units. There's a lot of tanked units nowadays that are so efficient that they rarely run out of hot water. We just swapped out an old 32 year old John Woods 40 gal two years ago for a 50 gal Bradford Whte and have yet to have a situation where the water available was running cool even after all three of us have taken showers baths sequentially. The JW model was still working, but I knew being that old it could disastruously go anytime, so when our A/C needed replacing and we knew the furnace was inadequate that got thrown in by the previous owner 20 years ago, we did all three at once. What a difference all around, especially the furnace. No more cold rooms upstairs. For the furnace and A/C we went with Daikin. They had a 12 year non-pro-rated warranty, no others we had quoted had that long.

    But back to your heater. Our Bradford White has a 10 year warranty we just had installed a couple of years ago. Have you checked to see that yours is not still under warranty? I don't even think BW is a primo brand for water heaters. I would have maybe liked a Smith, but the company we were going with didn't offer that brand and they were much more expensive, but their tanked heaters are actually true continuous supply rated water heaters when sized properly IIRC.

    https://www.aosmith.com/About/Brands/

    Failing that. have you tried calling around different water heating companies that sell/install them and try to pick their brains for free? Or even try calling the manufacturer in that regard and see what they say. Seems strange you have some kind of error coding that is not identified in the owner's manual.

    You may want to try the Ridgid Plumbing Forum site as a resource. It's almost all real pros on there, and there is a lot of discussion about water heaters. I read a lot on tankless stuff there years ago in addition to consulting plumbing guys I knew personally about tankless stuff. I was hell bent on getting a tankless for years for when we were to replace our old water heater, but I did eventually change my mind.
    Last edited by Lost in the Woods; 03-17-2019, 10:37 AM.

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  • Mike in Waubaushene
    replied
    Originally posted by John Bartley View Post

    I hadn't heard about "descaling", but it makes sense.
    Family of 4, descale every year. A couple or single person, every 2 years. With water softener, every 5 years.
    https://youtu.be/8-ts7XuvS48

    Leave a comment:


  • John Bartley
    replied
    Originally posted by Mike in Waubaushene View Post

    The tankless heaters are good, but need to be descaled every 6 months or so, depending on your water. Most people don’t do it and they are plugged up after 2-3 years.
    We needed to replace the water heater in a rental house, so we got advice from a couple of recommended local contractors. They said almost the same things .... tankless heaters suffer from corrosion ruining the exchanger piping if the hardness is not well controlled, and depending on where you are the temperature rise required may be too great to be economical. Here in Monteith our incoming water is about 5'C during the winter.

    I hadn't heard about "descaling", but it makes sense.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mike in Waubaushene
    replied
    Originally posted by RV Sam View Post
    Roger that bender. If i tossed this one out at only 5 and a half years old i would be ahead of a rental. That thought crossed my mind . Also figured that maybe now is the time for one of those tank-less ones but the cost changed my mind in a hurry. A friend collects scrap metals and i have seen 3 of those in his pile of junk over the last 6 months that looked new enough to sell. Not sure what problems they had to end up there but with that in mind and the cost i decided against it. I would also think that the burner in those tankless jobs would be huge gas eaters but know nothing about them so not sure.
    The tankless heaters are good, but need to be descaled every 6 months or so, depending on your water. Most people don’t do it and they are plugged up after 2-3 years.

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  • RV Sam
    replied
    Roger that bender. If i tossed this one out at only 5 and a half years old i would be ahead of a rental. That thought crossed my mind . Also figured that maybe now is the time for one of those tank-less ones but the cost changed my mind in a hurry. A friend collects scrap metals and i have seen 3 of those in his pile of junk over the last 6 months that looked new enough to sell. Not sure what problems they had to end up there but with that in mind and the cost i decided against it. I would also think that the burner in those tankless jobs would be huge gas eaters but know nothing about them so not sure.

    Leave a comment:


  • bender
    replied
    I replaced mine after about ten years. During that ten years I had replaced the ignitor and one of the gas valve solenoids. When another ignitor fried I didn't want to put any more money into a ten year old heater.

    Even if a new one costs 1000 its still more economical than renting. 30 a month times 5 years is 1800. I bet they're more than 30 a month now too.

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  • Bob just past Ayr
    replied
    Presume you have disconnected power and left for a minute and reconnected . Also check for correct voltage.

    Leave a comment:


  • RV Sam
    replied
    Thanks guys. None of those in this case. With a vent block the exhaust fan will come on, fail to get a good blow and will shut down. With the igniter the fan will come on and get a good blow on the go, open the gas valve that will let the gas flow and not light in a few seconds and go into shut down.
    Any of that i could prove out in a few minutes but this darn thing had me re thinking my thinking because except for one of the 6 LEDs being on (the B) there was NO sign of life at all. I could bypass a few things and fire up and the fan, get the gas valve to open ( just for a second , hehe ) but with everything set as it should, not a.... If i had to guess or walk the plank i would guess the main board that has the electronics in it. I wanted to buy one but i didn't, because if it was not that i could not return it. $350.. Soooo i did the hated thing, i called The Guy.. Went through 4 and no one wanted to touch this kind of heater due to all the electronics and sensors and this and that yak yak and how they changed parts and it didn't fix it and they had to take them out and now add that to there stock as no returns from them also. None of them had the main control board and didn't want to buy one to try. So i changed my story over to, do YOU have a control board for a GSW with White Rodgers # xxxxxxxxx that i got from the side of the module. Found a guy and he said he can be out in an hour with. How much total i asked, $450 tax in. So that's only 100 over if i had to get one myself and if it did not work for him he would take it out. " I have hot water now." Half the friggin' cost of the unit, wow. It came across my mind to just go get a new tank $995. This one will be 6 years old come October so could not force myself to do it and would have only a year warranty again anyway on anything that can go defective. 10 years on all parts that do not break down.
    This part FYI as it will be something i will look at come replacement time has the 1. probe for the temperature 2. gas valve 3. control module with the lights and buttons to set the temp ALL into the same unit. So i now have a good gas valve, a good thermometer that is useless , because a nickle item went out on a circuit board. Good thing that White Rodgers and GSW do not make cars because if they did and you had a flat tire you will need to change the tire, rim, axle, shocks, tie rods and maybe a few more item, WOW, shame shame shame.

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  • Matt Matt
    replied
    Generally the first thing you want to check is there is no external blockage due to snow. The second thing you want to check is,is the exhaust fan starts up. Then there is a couple relays. Then the igniter. Sometimes the igniter can get faulty. If everything checks, the next thing that clicks is the natural gas valve. Where are you in the sequence of things when you plug it in from a five-minute unplug?

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  • Mike in Waubaushene
    replied
    The exhaust outside is clear of snow??

    Leave a comment:

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