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  • rickyw
    started a topic cleaning hvlp gun

    cleaning hvlp gun

    using a fuji gxpc gravity cup for water base products, soap and water is what i been using to clean gun with , any one use acetone or denatured alcohol ? I under stand mineral spirts is a no ? , just curious as to methods others are using

  • John JMK
    replied
    As a small side note most of us regularly spraying WB products have guns with stainless steel parts and passages, the recommendation to use some kind of solvent after flushing is put in a lot of PDS information mainly for those using guns and pressure pots, etc that aren't stainless or when using lower end guns that don't use a high quality stainless steel, to help prevent the corrosion from a typically highly acidic product.

    Leave a comment:


  • Woodwreck
    replied
    Originally posted by the_other_ken View Post
    Now that we are back on topic

    I was sloppy and careless and let my gun and 3M PPS system get covered with slopped shellac and waterborne. I tried a little scrapping to try to pop it off but no luck.


    P.S. I am now cleaning my gun religiously.
    Ouch, Your note is painful to read.

    Leave a comment:


  • Woodwreck
    replied
    Originally posted by John JMK View Post
    Paul I was just going through some PDF's for SW Kem Aqua products. To add/reenforce what is being discussed, this was their recommendation WB for cleanup.

    "Clean tools/equipment immediately after use with water. Flush equipment with water followed by flushing with 2 parts water and 1 part Butyl Cellosolve R6K25 or Acetone R6K9."
    I'm with John, using exactly the same product but a word of warning. All "water base" products are not the same and I'm no chemist. Be sure to get your manufacturer's literature and cleaner product! Kem Aqua which John and I have been using is an alcohol based solvent as I understand it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rob Brown
    replied
    Good to see this thread back on track. Playing nicely is what we're all about here!

    Leave a comment:


  • the_other_ken
    replied
    Now that we are back on topic

    I was sloppy and careless and let my gun and 3M PPS system get covered with slopped shellac and waterborne. I tried a little scrapping to try to pop it off but no luck.

    I had some household ammonia and heard that it destroyed shellac. I took my lid from the PPS system which was covered with finish and dropped in a container with some ammonia. I figured it would at least remove the shellac. After about 15 minutes I pulled it out. The finish quite soft and starting to decompose. I took an old toothbrush (and my fingernails and cleaned it up like new. Dropped the rest of PPS system into ammonia and with a little elbow grease they came out looking like new.

    Next, the gun. It is a Fuji T-series made from chromed steel? Tested the ammonia on the metal and the plastic of the handle, and it didn't seem to cause any problems like etching or discoloring. I wet a couple of blue shop towels and wrapped my gun in them. A few minutes later and some more elbow grease, my gun now looks like new.

    If you are a "finishing pig" like I was, you may be able to redeem yourself using this technique. I don't know if ammonia will work as well with oil or lacquer finishes. Also test it first in case the ammonia will affect you guns parts....I'm not sure what it would do to aluminum....

    P.S. I am now cleaning my gun religiously.
    Last edited by the_other_ken; 11-14-2018, 04:55 PM. Reason: speeling and grammer

    Leave a comment:


  • callee
    replied
    Back on topic, I just got the following email from ML Campbell:

    "Hot" water would not be recommend as it can bake the coating depending on
    how hot. We recommend simply warm water or room temperature water is
    fine. Even 50/50 mix water and denatured alcohol is very effective for
    cleaning waterbornes. The carrier in a waterborne is water so yes hot
    water will wash it away!

    Thank you for your inquiry,
    M.L. Campbell Technical Services
    1-800-364-1359 option 1
    techservices@mlcampbell.com
    Well, that's an eye opener! Learn something new every day.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rusty
    replied
    Originally posted by Randy in Calgary View Post

    This isn't about you , Donald.
    Couldn't resist apparently.

    As messages go it must be a private one huh?

    Leave a comment:


  • Randy in Calgary
    replied
    Originally posted by Rusty View Post
    Ryan, I wonder what the peanut gallery would think of your comments if Rusty had said them? Think about it for a second.
    This isn't about you , Donald.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rusty
    replied
    Ryan, I wonder what the peanut gallery would think of your comments if Rusty had said them? Think about it for a second.

    Leave a comment:


  • callee
    replied
    Originally posted by Paul O in Paris View Post

    Really? You sure seem to be putting out a lot of time and effort to prove you are right. To me there is no "right" or "wrong" in this, just good operating practice and not so good operating practice. Looking at it as right or wrong is rather immature IMO and reminds me of my days at university in the late sixties when hand scrawled posters went up inviting us to a "mass debate" on some burning topic of the day. I went to two and got fed up with self righteous,bright eyed zealots who were full of their own self importance spouting all kinds of crap and then branding anyone who stood up and questioned them or expressed any kind of contrary opinion as being totally wrong, a communist, a fascist, uninformed, unaware etc etc. I had no time for "mass debaters" then and I have not changed my opinion of people with that behaviour.

    If you are using Agualente then you are hardly operating at the leading edge of waterbased technology as it is probably one of the worst products out there. ML Campbell has a long history of substandard waterbased finishes and has now resorted to trying to piggyback on their successful solvent products by introducing Magnamax H2O.
    Here's a link to the Agualente PDI, check the section "Equipment Clean Up"
    It reads


    Equipment Clean Up



    All equipment should be flushed with warm water or water/alcohol immediately after use.



    A subsequent flush with alcohol will ensure all moisture is removed from equipment.

    https://distributorserviceinc.com/PD...Lacquer-PI.pdf

    As John pointed out, Becca is not a finish supplier. I waded through their website and they market products for cleaning equipment used in industrial painting. I was not impressed as it seemed like a snake oil sales pitch. What really got me was the typo in the banner title on the linked to page. No reference to furniture finishes. I guess you didn't do your due diligence before posting.

    Anyway, that's enough from me

    Paul

    Paul! I think you're reading into my post a tone that reflects your opinion of me, rather than the tone I actually had. If someone suddenly told you that something you'd done for years was a problem, I'm sure you'd at least explore the issue a bit before changing your habit. So yeah, I'm checking it out a bit. I think that just makes me normal, I don't think that makes me a "self righteous,bright eyed zealots who were full of their own self importance spouting all kinds of crap," though it's not surprising to me that you'd compare me to them. Most people here aren't aware of the nasty, hurtful things you've said to me in PMs [correction: meant to say "since deleted posts"] before. It was mean enough, it's the only time I've every considered quitting this place. I've never quite been able to figure out why you dislike me, especially since I've never felt anything for you but respect for your expertise and appreciation for your contributions. But, live and let live I guess.
    Last edited by callee; 11-13-2018, 08:28 PM. Reason: correction

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  • Paul O in Paris
    replied
    Originally posted by callee View Post

    I'm happy to be wrong, but since my experience is to the contrary, I've decided to look into it a bit first.

    So I've written to the company directly. I'll post when I get a response.

    Meanwhile, for whatever it's worth, I did find another finish company. Becca, that does advocate using hot water:
    Really? You sure seem to be putting out a lot of time and effort to prove you are right. To me there is no "right" or "wrong" in this, just good operating practice and not so good operating practice. Looking at it as right or wrong is rather immature IMO and reminds me of my days at university in the late sixties when hand scrawled posters went up inviting us to a "mass debate" on some burning topic of the day. I went to two and got fed up with self righteous,bright eyed zealots who were full of their own self importance spouting all kinds of crap and then branding anyone who stood up and questioned them or expressed any kind of contrary opinion as being totally wrong, a communist, a fascist, uninformed, unaware etc etc. I had no time for "mass debaters" then and I have not changed my opinion of people with that behaviour.

    If you are using Agualente then you are hardly operating at the leading edge of waterbased technology as it is probably one of the worst products out there. ML Campbell has a long history of substandard waterbased finishes and has now resorted to trying to piggyback on their successful solvent products by introducing Magnamax H2O.
    Here's a link to the Agualente PDI, check the section "Equipment Clean Up"
    It reads


    Equipment Clean Up



    All equipment should be flushed with warm water or water/alcohol immediately after use.



    A subsequent flush with alcohol will ensure all moisture is removed from equipment.

    https://distributorserviceinc.com/PD...Lacquer-PI.pdf

    As John pointed out, Becca is not a finish supplier. I waded through their website and they market products for cleaning equipment used in industrial painting. I was not impressed as it seemed like a snake oil sales pitch. What really got me was the typo in the banner title on the linked to page. No reference to furniture finishes. I guess you didn't do your due diligence before posting.

    Anyway, that's enough from me

    Paul

    Last edited by Paul O in Paris; 11-10-2018, 07:22 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • callee
    replied
    Originally posted by John JMK View Post
    It appears that Becca doesn't sell finishes but cleaning products and the hot water works with there cleaning product and specialized cleaning system.
    Unfortunately when I have used ML Campbell WB products in the past and had issues I found there product support team next to useless. Maybe you'll have better luck now that they are owned by Sherwin Williams but still operate as a separate entity. Most companies recommend warm water not hot as you will find in the ML Campbell Agualente PDS.

    https://www.paintdocs.com/docs/webPD...S&prodno=0 35777318744&lang=2
    Thanks John. I had been reading that, and I noticed it did recommend "warm water", but the nit picky side of me is stuck on the fact that it says nothing about hot water yay or nay.

    I guess the real thing for me is the fact that I've been using hot water for a number of years now, and it's simply worked great. If using hot water causes problems, then why haven't I had any?

    I'm not assuming my experience is definitive or anything, it's just a head scratcher moment - almost like when someone comes along and suddenly tells you something like "tobogganing is unsafe for children" and you're like "huh?!? I've tobogganed all my life! What do you mean it's not safe!?"

    I can see a degree of sense in what Paul said - about heat causing the finish to solidify. I mean, that does make sense in a way.

    But I wonder about the issue of flow?

    That is, take an egg for example. Hot water can also cook an egg. CRack an egg in a bowl, add in some boiling water, give it a minute, and that egg will be poached. But the important part there is "give it a minute". The egg gets to sit there for a couple minutes in the hot water so that the cooking can happen. But what if I held that egg under a running flow of hot water? It wouldn't cook at all, of course, it would simply be washed away.

    Now, I know there's a difference between WB finish and eggs, of course, but isn't the principle the same? Doesn't the flow of the hot water wash away the finish residue long before it gets a chance to solidify?

    I do hope the ML Campbell people write me back.

    Leave a comment:


  • Brian @ Muir
    replied
    Although I have never used waterbourne products I was told by my ML Campbell dealer that if I was to use waterborne my final flush should be with a lacquer thinner after the warm water. I use a Kremlin system.

    Brian

    Leave a comment:


  • John JMK
    replied
    It appears that Becca doesn't sell finishes but cleaning products and the hot water works with there cleaning product and specialized cleaning system.
    Unfortunately when I have used ML Campbell WB products in the past and had issues I found there product support team next to useless. Maybe you'll have better luck now that they are owned by Sherwin Williams but still operate as a separate entity. Most companies recommend warm water not hot as you will find in the ML Campbell Agualente PDS.

    https://www.paintdocs.com/docs/webPD...S&prodno=0 35777318744&lang=2
    Last edited by John JMK; 11-10-2018, 02:57 PM.

    Leave a comment:

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