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  • Filling Pores - Ash with WB Poly

    I'm into new territory here so I thought I would ask before I do too much experimenting! I typically use hardwax oils to keep my finishing simple.

    I'm finishing up an ash dining table top and to keep the tone of the wood, I'm going to use water-based poly. I'm picking up a can of Deft to see how it does, as I'm not entirely happy with Varathane Diamond Finish. After 3 coats of the stuff though it's pretty clear that no matter what I do I'll need to fill the pores. There's plenty of info out there about thinning down solvent-based filler, but what about water-based? Is it as simple as grabbing some big-box (elmer's) filler, water it down, and then go to town with it?

    Also - are there alternate approaches where I could fill the grain using a water-based slurry method? With an oil poly you can essentially throw it on and give it a rough sand, and after one or two rounds you've filled the pores. Does this work with WB Poly? And what about just layering the poly on and on and sanding between coats? Does that work well to fill the pores - but if so, is it a big PITA?

    Obviously I'll be experimenting but I would love some words of wisdom to help guide me along!
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  • #2

    Re: Filling Pores - Ash with WB Poly

    The best advice you will get will come from Paul IMHO. There are others here like Don Kondra who are very knowledgeable too.

    However let me try this, If you wanted to level the mountains would it not be easier to wear them down first and cover them with a thin layer of soil. Then wear that layer down and apply more soil, Then do it again and again until ultimately they would level off. There is absolutely nothing wrong with your varathane product. Apply it, sand it, apply it ,sand it and do it again until it's level.
    "Do it Right!"

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    • #3

      Re: Filling Pores - Ash with WB Poly

      Originally posted by Rusty View Post
      The best advice you will get will come from Paul IMHO. There are others here like Don Kondra who are very knowledgeable too.

      However let me try this, If you wanted to level the mountains would it not be easier to wear them down first and cover them with a thin layer of soil. Then wear that layer down and apply more soil, Then do it again and again until ultimately they would level off. There is absolutely nothing wrong with your varathane product. Apply it, sand it, apply it ,sand it and do it again until it's level.
      sorry, re-reading my post it comes across that I thought the product would fill pores... that's not the case. to clarify what I meant, my unhappiness is with the color/tone, not the evenness of it... i can apply it fine, it's just not as clear as i was expecting. and no matter what poly I use, I'll need to fill the pores.

      what you're describing - is the intent to fill the pores with the sanded-off product? I typically wipe it clean and vacuum/air blast it before the second coat - should I be leaving the powdery residue to help fill the pores?

      Comment


      • #4

        Re: Filling Pores - Ash with WB Poly

        Originally posted by guitarchitect View Post
        There's plenty of info out there about thinning down solvent-based filler, but what about water-based? Is it as simple as grabbing some big-box (elmer's) filler, water it down, and then go to town with it?

        Also - are there alternate approaches where I could fill the grain using a water-based slurry method?
        Over the years I have found AquaCoat to work reasonably well with clear waterbased finishes. Target Coating have a grain filler, but it is primarily designed for use under pigmented topcoats. There are other products out there that are similar. Search for " clear waterbased grain filler ".
        Just follow the prep instructions on the tub, especially for sanding and clean up.
        What I like about the AquaCoat is that you apply it after a coat of finish or sealer. Just squeegee it on and wipe off, with and across the grain, let dry for recommended period of time then scuff back. If it needs more, just slap some more on and repeat. I usually apply a thin coat of sealer (or diluted finish) after first application to see what it looks like.
        Unlike the solvent based product I use to fill grain, I have found the waterbased stuff doesn't always give a perfectly flat surface, but it's definitely acceptable and can be worked with very easily.

        Click image for larger version

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        I would not use the slurry method with waterbased finishes if you want a clear fill in the pores

        Hope that helps
        Paul



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        • #5

          Re: Filling Pores - Ash with WB Poly

          Originally posted by guitarchitect View Post

          sorry, re-reading my post it comes across that i thought the product would fill pores... That's not the case. To clarify what i meant, my unhappiness is with the color/tone, not the evenness of it... I can apply it fine, it's just not as clear as i was expecting. And no matter what poly i use, i'll need to fill the pores.

          What you're describing - is the intent to fill the pores with the sanded-off product? I typically wipe it clean and vacuum/air blast it before the second coat - should i be leaving the powdery residue to help fill the pores?


          no!
          "Do it Right!"

          Comment


          • #6

            Re: Filling Pores - Ash with WB Poly

            Originally posted by Paul O in Paris View Post

            Over the years I have found AquaCoat to work reasonably well with clear waterbased finishes. Target Coating have a grain filler, but it is primarily designed for use under pigmented topcoats. There are other products out there that are similar. Search for " clear waterbased grain filler ".
            Just follow the prep instructions on the tub, especially for sanding and clean up.
            What I like about the AquaCoat is that you apply it after a coat of finish or sealer. Just squeegee it on and wipe off, with and across the grain, let dry for recommended period of time then scuff back. If it needs more, just slap some more on and repeat. I usually apply a thin coat of sealer (or diluted finish) after first application to see what it looks like.
            Unlike the solvent based product I use to fill grain, I have found the waterbased stuff doesn't always give a perfectly flat surface, but it's definitely acceptable and can be worked with very easily.

            Click image for larger version

Name:	AquaCoat pkg.jpg
Views:	20
Size:	1.02 MB
ID:	1214815Click image for larger version

Name:	Aquacoat.jpg
Views:	20
Size:	19.3 KB
ID:	1214814

            I would not use the slurry method with waterbased finishes if you want a clear fill in the pores

            Hope that helps
            Paul


            Funny enough I've got a tub in my bag right now! I couldn't find it locally for some reason, which is why I made my post... And then I reached out to them and they said LV carries it. When I looked on LVs site initially I was looking for it in the finishes section with the other fillers... Wasn't there. I searched "aqua" and found it. Made the trek there and came home and here's your post!

            Got any suggestions for WB poly products? I've got some deft indoor/outdoor water based poly in my bag too, which I'm looking forward to trying out!

            Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk

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            • #7

              Re: Filling Pores - Ash with WB Poly

              Originally posted by guitarchitect View Post

              Got any suggestions for WB poly products?
              Not really as I don't use it. Don't want to come across as some kind of elitist jerk, but I use commercial grade products because I have a finishing/refinishing business.
              For a long time I used Target Coatings products almost exclusively when waterbased finishes were called for, but although the quality is hard to beat, the price has really increased and I have to remain competitive. I have also found that, over the last 5 yrs, waterbased finishes from most of the leading manufacturers have made quantum leaps in quality, ease of application, durability etc but most of those products are not available to the general public, so my recommendations wouldn't really help.
              Target EM2000 is an excellent product that you can order through Wood Essence and either have shipped to you (except in really cold weather) or pick up direct from the shipper in Burlington. It's actually a hybrid varnish rather than a polyurethane, but there are plenty of other folks on this forum who use it and are extremely satisfied.
              http://www.woodessence.com/EM2000-Al...sh-P56C22.aspx

              Hope the AquaCoat works for you.

              Paul
              Last edited by Paul O in Paris; 12-21-2018, 07:30 PM.

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