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For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

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  • For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

    Here are the possible reasons I collected:
    ​​​​​​
    - Too tight
    - Too loose
    - Collet bad
    - Bit bad
    - Collet dirty
    - Bit dirty
    - Too much bite
    - Too blunt

    here's the thing though,

    I have attached pictures of the bit and collet. I don't really know how to tell which the issue is?

    I think the issue is one of too much bite. I'm using my homemade router table as a jointer following this video:

    https://youtu.be/H6nql7mlSOo
    I clamped a 1/8" MDF piece onto the outfeed segment of my router table fence. I checked with a straight edge to make sure my blade was in line with the "left fence". When I was cutting, it was going fine until at some point, I noticed that part of this one board (part of the edge closest to the table surface) wasn't getting cut. I lowered the router a small amount, thinking I had not accounted for the bottom of the edge having just flipped the piece to the other side, or something.

    When I started router-jointing again, I noticed the router bit started slowly rising. I don't know what happens when a high-speed bit leaves a router, but managed to switch off the router before I was unlucky enough to find out.

    It's a 1/4" router and 1/4" bit and collet. Would everyone agree that I was just taking a heavy bite? Should I try idk, planing the 1/8" MDF? Should I put 1/16" something or the other on the "right fence" ?


    I'm thinking about selling my 1/4" router and doing everything with my 1/2" router since it comes with a 1/2"/1/4" collet adapter. Has anyone done this bother and never found themselves needing their smaller router again? Or is there value to keeping the 1/4" router? I only paid 50 bucks for the thing, I wouldn't mind keeping it if it's useful. The best reason I have right now for keeping it, is that I can have one router dedicated to my router table jig and the other for general routing. Having said that, my jig accepts a router on metal guide rails and has a knob lockoff, so it's easy to pop a router in and out of the thing.

    ​​​​​​I'm hoping I can get the router table jointer setup to work, because I also tried router sledding again today (with my 1/2" router) and it was actually working pretty well. If I can do it so both faces are surfaced parallel to each other, I may consider selling the loud, bulky, heavy lunchbox planer I have, and just router sledding my boards and my glue ups.

    Open to opinions about any of this, thanks in advance.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by Jfd986; 09-13-2021, 09:00 PM.
  • Thread Continues Below...

  • #2

    Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

    Hard to tell from the pics, but neither the collet nor the router bit shaft look to be in pristine condition.

    Unscrew the collet nut entirely and lift out the collect. Use lacquer thinner or similar (but not a lubricant) to clean the inside of the collet and the slits in its sides that allow it to compress around the router bit shaft. Clean the cavity the collet sits in and re-assemble. Clean the router bit shaft. Try again with a slow feed rate.

    Comment


    • #3

      Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

      You have answered your own question … and that is the 1/8” bite is too much. There is probably a combination of factors allowing the bit to drift. Using a 1/4” collet does not provide as much circumference holding grip as using a 1/2” collet, and taking a heavy cut means the router motor is working hard, creating heat … which allows the hot collet (touch it after a cut) to expand enough for the bit to drift. Having a dull bit and running many board feet through just amplifies the problem. Cleaning the dust out of the collet should also be done.

      Tightening the collet further will not improve the situation. For a small powered router that you have, try taking 1/32” or less on a pass.
      Anyone who doesn’t think money grows on trees hasn’t bought any lumber lately.

      Comment


      • #4

        Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

        Originally posted by Kunzwerks View Post
        You have answered your own question … and that is the 1/8” bite is too much. There is probably a combination of factors allowing the bit to drift. Using a 1/4” collet does not provide as much circumference holding grip as using a 1/2” collet, and taking a heavy cut means the router motor is working hard, creating heat … which allows the hot collet (touch it after a cut) to expand enough for the bit to drift. Having a dull bit and running many board feet through just amplifies the problem. Cleaning the dust out of the collet should also be done.

        Tightening the collet further will not improve the situation. For a small powered router that you have, try taking 1/32” or less on a pass.
        To take 1/32" or less on a pass, I'm thinking I'd either have to
        - Put a 1/32" piece of wood on the outfeed segment of the fence and line the bit up with that, Or

        - Put a 3/64" piece on the infeed part of the fence and leave the 1/8" piece on the outfeed part of the fence.


        Does my router bit look dull? I bought it used and it's Mastercraft, so I wasn't expecting much but I don't really know how to gauge "sharp" vs "dull" for router bits. Idk they all feel pokey and pointed.

        I will clean the dust out of the collet tomorrow as described by another poster, but you touched on something that I hadn't mentioned. The router bit felt Very hot when I stopped the router and tried to pull it out. Clearly this may have contributed in some way to it needing out of the router, I wasn't sure whether they just always run hot. I ran downstairs tonight and checked, my 1/2" router fits my jig just as well as my 1/4" router! I don't know why Ryobi picked this opportunity to bless me with intelligent design, but the guide rail hole spacing and diameter is the same.

        I can try my 1/2" straight bit tomorrow for the router jointer, but I was wondering ... How much "more" would I be able to go for with it? Would 1/8" bites be fine with a 1/2" router and bit or is it still a matter of lessening the outfeed fence piece thickness?


        Comment


        • #5

          Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

          A 1/8” cut, even on a proper jointer is a VERY heavy cut. Try to get it down to something more reasonable, say 1/16”, knowing you have a limited choice of material for off setting the desired thickness. Your 1/2” router is a much better choice on your router table.

          You can sharpen router bits using a diamond sharpening stone. https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop...d-paddle-hones
          Anyone who doesn’t think money grows on trees hasn’t bought any lumber lately.

          Comment


          • #6

            Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

            What kind and how old (how much use) has the bit had. Looks a bit dark meaning maybe burnt or dirty and/or maybe dull plus as Kenneth said take smaller bites.
            John@Hamilton likes this.
            Jamie www.turneddesignsbyjamie.etsy.com

            Comment

            • Thread Continues Below...

            • #7

              Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

              As per post #2 clean it all up. Follow by using a very fine sandpaper on the collet bore and bit shaft and then sharpen the bit. Make sure it’s in tight and try it.

              If the cut is too deep or the feed rate high the wood will start to burn and the router slows down. The type of wood and grain direction and feed rate involved are also factors. It’s a matter of adjusting to all the conditions to get the proper results. There are no set rules, just adjustment to conditions.

              Follow up by chucking the bit and buying a new one! Or do that first.
              Egon
              from
              The South Shore, Nova Scotia

              Comment


              • #8

                Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                I’m sure you know this but every so often it happens. I have 4 routers. Each collet can be fake tight or real tight.
                Real tight is that extra turn you apply after fake tight.
                And 1/8” is, as most have noted, to heavy a cut.
                If you think you need to take off that much material, take most of it off using your table saw. As a matter of fact, get a glue line rip blade and forget about the router idea. You will never look back.

                Don
                KenL likes this.

                Comment


                • #9

                  Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                  When you install the bit lift it about 3/16 inch from the bottom of collet before tightening.
                  It shouldn't slip in my opinion even if dull or heavy cut. It should break first
                  nugsthecat, Egon and Kayak Jim like this.
                  Dara
                  SPCHT

                  Comment


                  • #10

                    Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                    Originally posted by jaywood1207 View Post
                    What kind and how old (how much use) has the bit had. Looks a bit dark meaning maybe burnt or dirty and/or maybe dull plus as Kenneth said take smaller bites.
                    It's a Mastercraft bit and I got it used last year, no idea how much use it's had. It's quite possible it's had a considerable amount of use. I'm going to rebuild my router table fence today so that I can start taking smaller bites.

                    Comment


                    • #11

                      Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                      Originally posted by Egon View Post
                      As per post #2 clean it all up. Follow by using a very fine sandpaper on the collet bore and bit shaft and then sharpen the bit. Make sure it’s in tight and try it.

                      If the cut is too deep or the feed rate high the wood will start to burn and the router slows down. The type of wood and grain direction and feed rate involved are also factors. It’s a matter of adjusting to all the conditions to get the proper results. There are no set rules, just adjustment to conditions.

                      Follow up by chucking the bit and buying a new one! Or do that first.
                      Chucking the bit is on the table, because I'm going to switch to my 1/2" router for the next router table jointing endeavour. I will only be trying that, however, after I rebuild my router table fence so I can have movable left and right fence segments. Then I'll be able to put washers behind the right fence for more conservative jointing instead of slapping a 1/8" thick board on top of the right fence.

                      Comment

                      • Thread Continues Below...

                      • #12

                        Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                        Originally posted by Dara View Post
                        When you install the bit lift it about 3/16 inch from the bottom of collet before tightening.
                        It shouldn't slip in my opinion even if dull or heavy cut. It should break first
                        I'll double check my bit lift by measuring next time. I always lift "a little" because I figure there's some sort of "smaller" shank segment that the collet is not supposed to grab onto, but I'll measure next time thanks.

                        Comment


                        • #13

                          Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                          Originally posted by Kenneth View Post
                          Hard to tell from the pics, but neither the collet nor the router bit shaft look to be in pristine condition.

                          Unscrew the collet nut entirely and lift out the collect. Use lacquer thinner or similar (but not a lubricant) to clean the inside of the collet and the slits in its sides that allow it to compress around the router bit shaft. Clean the cavity the collet sits in and re-assemble. Clean the router bit shaft. Try again with a slow feed rate.
                          Would mineral spirits be okay? Some wood fell down yesterday and punctured a hole in the gallon bottle. After I poured what I could into empty tennis ball containers, the rest is still in the jug sitting upside down. I am highly motivated to use mineral spirits if this would be possible.

                          Comment


                          • #14

                            Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                            Originally posted by Jfd986 View Post

                            I'll double check my bit lift by measuring next time. I always lift "a little" because I figure there's some sort of "smaller" shank segment that the collet is not supposed to grab onto, but I'll measure next time thanks.
                            The reason you raise the bit slightly is because as you cut, the bit heats up and expands, if it is bottomed out cold the expansion can push the bit out of the collet.

                            Comment


                            • #15

                              Re: For which of these reasons, is my router bit slipping?

                              The way a collet works is with a taper. It initially grips the bit and then pulls it down and the taper tightens with the grooves. If the shank is already in the bottom it can't be pulled down into the taper. Make sure also to clean sawdust out of the hole. And tighten it real good.
                              There is no way a properly installed bit would slip, old, hot, dull, too deep a cut doesn't matter
                              Dara
                              SPCHT

                              Comment

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