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  • Kitchen Ceiling advise please

    Hey Guys,

    I live in house built in 1972 in Brampton, Ontario. The whole house has popcorn ceiling which I hate with a passion. Now that I decided to tackle it, I started with our kitchen(yes even the kitchen has popcorn ceiling). I tired various methods, tried scrapping, spaying it with water for 3 days, and 1/2 hour before trying to scrape etc. Even tried vinegar/water solution. It appears the popcorn has been painted over, maybe even few time.

    I even bought the drywall sander which was absolutely useless. I tried drywall(mesh) sand paper on my 5" orbital sander with no luck. The regular 40/60 grit sandpaper seems to work but it gets completely clogged in 5 seconds and cleaning it is messy and take much longer.

    With 1/3 scraped..and it looking like it will need completely coated with mud, I have decided that it would less work just to remove the whole ceiling and install new drywall. I am just wondering if someone can help me with type of drywall that I need to use. Can I use 1/2" or do I have to use 5/8", there is regular and mold resistant and then there is fire-rated type X.

    I just wanted to know are there any building codes or by-laws that dictate on what to use. I have been searching but haven't found anything conclusive.

    I would greatly appreciate it, if someone can point me into the right direction.

    Thanks,
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  • #2

    Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

    Somewhere in the deep recesses of a mostly defective memory is a vision of a steamer/scraper, designed for removing stipple from ceilings ..... can't find it on the web today, but I am sure I have seen this tool.

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    • #3

      Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

      Float it with drywall mud?
      Board over it (if you don't have crown moulding)?
      Wally in Calgary likes this.

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      • #4

        Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

        If it is supported on 16 inch centers 1/2 inch drywall is what most use. There is 5/8 drywall available and usually is when drywall is hung on 24 inch centers. If doing just the kitchen I would replace with new drywall. OBC does not require fire rated in residence.
        If your dreams don't scare you, you are not dreaming big enough

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        • #5

          Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

          In New Zealand we use mostly 10mm or to you guys 3/8" dry wall on both walls and ceilings, on ceilings we space the ceiling battens at 16" walls have studs generally at 24" but then we have rows of nogs horizontally at 800mm centers so that's 2 rows of nogs in a 2.4 meter high wall.
          Its now over 3 years since I finished my house renovation, I replaced all the dry wall in the house walls and ceilings by doing that I was able to get rid of all the old ceiling insulation (mashed up news papers poor insulation) I was able to run all new electrics, I was able to straighten bent walls and get rid of some woodworm, with ceilings I put up steel ceiling battens so now my ceilings are dead true, it all worked out well the house was built in the days of imperial measurments so my walls were 8 feet, our drywall is 2.4meters so by installing steel ceiling batten I brought my wall height down to 2.4, the house inside is now like a new house.
          Once you get started its easy its just a matter of time and the end result is worth it.

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          • #6

            Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

            Try scaping it with a spade, or replace the drywall. You could sheet overtop, but I would suggest taking it out. That will open up more options to you in terms of lighting, (pot lights), network cabling, electrical upgrades, etc., etc..

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            • #7

              Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

              There also is 1/2" ceiling drywall that is more sag resistant. Also rember it comes in longer lengths than 8ft which may save joints. A drywall lift is your friend.
              Bob just past Ayr

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              • #8

                Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                There's 1/4 inch drywall available. It's light and easy to work with. Just board over what's there, no need to remove anything.

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                • #9

                  Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                  I never understand why Ontario and other province builders do popcorn.. vs Quebec. just mind boggling.

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                  • #10

                    Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                    Originally posted by EFZauner View Post
                    I never understand why Ontario and other province builders do popcorn.. vs Quebec. just mind boggling.
                    It's probably a good cover for an uneven ceiling, unless you get those joints good and flat they are hard to mud and get a good finish, I would guess if the OP puts 1/4" dry wall over the existing it will be hard to get a good finish then it will need popcorn to camouflager the poor joints.

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                    • #11

                      Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                      Originally posted by bkrits View Post

                      It's probably a good cover for an uneven ceiling, unless you get those joints good and flat they are hard to mud and get a good finish, I would guess if the OP puts 1/4" dry wall over the existing it will be hard to get a good finish then it will need popcorn to camouflager the poor joints.
                      Dunno, pretty much every house in Quebec has normal flat drywall on ceiling. No issues with joists. Furring strips in between. Not sure if popcorn ceilings have them between.

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                      • #12

                        Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                        Originally posted by EFZauner View Post

                        Dunno, pretty much every house in Quebec has normal flat drywall on ceiling. No issues with joists. Furring strips in between. Not sure if popcorn ceilings have them between.
                        I'm not sure what you are saying here, maybe you need to read my comment again.

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                        • #13

                          Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                          Originally posted by EFZauner View Post
                          I never understand why Ontario and other province builders do popcorn.. vs Quebec. just mind boggling.
                          Haven't seen stipple ceiling in a newly built home in quite some time (Manitoba).
                          I think it "went out of style"...

                          Comment


                          • #14

                            Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                            Id use a drywall lift, 10 foot sheets of 1/2" If you have a separate tenant or may have a separate suite then it may need 5/8 fireproof. you can check the local code. if you want to cheap out you can make T shaped 2x4's and lift it and stick them under until you get some screws in.

                            if ceiling height is not an issue I'd leave it there. id use 1/4" on walls and that went ok but I'd use 1/2" you can get lightweight drywall, that might reduce the weight. If you wanto stop noise you can use 5/8 soundproof drywall but its about 75 bucks a sheet for 4x8 , make sure your screws penetrate the joist enough so you need longer screws. i'd say 1 3/4 or 2" you have an inch of material so the rest penetrates.

                            if you want to reduce sound and not spend too much you can look at using green glue. its not glue but it makes a rubbery layer that never really dries , you still use the screws. It helps block sound. If you really want to block sound there are systems that can separate the layers as screws short it out and carry the sound. metal clips and stuff..

                            acoustic tiles are usually ugly in my opinion but that may be an option too. some may say to remove the popcorn I'd resheet it myself.

                            first thing figure out how the joist runs drill little holes and locate each one mark it on the wall then you can pull snap lines later on when you have your drywall starting to go on. use enough screws. dont use nails.

                            id use the metal /paper corner bead and I like to bed mine and the tape with some carpenters glue. a nail every 4 feet or so to make it stay in place.. a pro wont add the glue but i dont like peeling tape issues so I use about 50 /50 glue and water and pull the tape through that then bed it as normal. outside corners should have the corner bead , with inside corners it's optional some just fold the paper tape. I find it helps me keep the corners crisp if I use the bead so I always use it. i dont like the mesh , some do.

                            you can mix carpenters glue into mud and it will make it hard like rock and you can't sand it. sometimes I feel a bit sorry for the old carpenters they use to make the glue ;-) Ill do that for filling cracks etc. if you like you can add plaster or use quick setting stuff designed for that it has some plaster in it. with plaster you mix in water and it hardens like concrete so clean your tools after each mix. the only reason I add plaster is if it's filling holes and stuff and I want to apply it super thick, like if you have a 1/2" gap it will fill that. I never have issues with tape peeling or corner bead being detached but a pro wont use the glue and will have a better technique. some squeeze too much mud out when they bed tape and then it can fail to adhere. if the tape comes loose it will make you go nutty so be careful with how you do that.

                            use taping mud for taping, medium or regular to fill and then use finishing mud for finishing and add more water. I mix my mud quite thin never use it straight from the bucket. I mix it with a drill night before let the bubbles rise out. use a taping knife for taping and a wider knife for filling and then I use a wider one yet for skim coating with thinner and finer mud. sand in circles , so me use a pole I'd rather do it by hand and then I can feel how flat it is with my hands better. something movable you can stand on is hepful. i have a high ceiling and I borrowed a proper platform with wheels to stand on.

                            if you want to add a neat look you can get metal bead with about a 1/2" radius curve to the corner it can add a touch of class without adding a lot of work. maybe that's an option to crown molding.

                            measure where the light pots are you will need to either use box extenders or relocate the box to make it flush if you have lights up there. they should be flush and not recessed when you are done, if you like you can do that first. dont hit wires with your screws. turn the breaker off to kill the power to anything you suspect
                            and use an extension cord for the light a fluorescent tube is good to put near the ceiling to see waves and sags. you could use a laser level that spins and maybe that would e helpful or a long straight edge to check for references.

                            get it close then primer it one coat so you aren't sanding off too much, and you can see where the new mud is and you wont go as crazy.. then do your finish coats. do as many as it takes to make everyone happy. dont be afraid to primer between coats. the better it is the more shiny the paint you can use. I like to go an extra level and do a nice job and and use kitchen and bath paint so it's more washable, but if you want it done faster or if you just get sick of it all then choose a more flat paint so it doesn't show the sins. the reason they used popcorn was to save work in finishing.

                            there might be tools to remove the popcorn you could ask at home depot in the rentals section and pick their brains they sometimes know lots or sometimes they know nothing.. worth a try. commercial and specific drywall supply places might also be good resources. another way is to hire a drywaller and act as their helper then you will learn more. a real pro drywaller can run circles around most weekenders. Kitchens are the worst part due to living in the dust if you can vacate you are ahead. If your spouse is living there make sure you discuss their expectations because this can cause divorce ;-) I call it cleaning powder. it helps you see at a glance where you haven't cleaned yet.

                            floor drips use pastic or if you have a mopable floor you can mop each day as you go you will get better at not dropping mud, you'll see ;-)
                            Last edited by stickman; 09-17-2021, 06:11 PM.

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                            • #15

                              Re: Kitchen Ceiling advise please

                              I think it depends on how the popcorn was put on. In my house, I've removed it from a hallway and bathroom and it came of quite easy with just a little water and a wide putty knife.

                              I have heard of it being mixed with latex paint (rather than water?) to liquefy the mixture before spraying. I may have also been painted over. Both the these would make it very hard to remove.

                              You need to get the joints very smooth if you have ceiling mounted lights. The angle the light will cast across the ceiling will show every defect. Our original mudding job was only the taped with maybe a quick second coat over the tape.
                              the other Ken
                              ------
                              "Each flitch, each board, each plant can have only one ideal use. The woodworker, applying a thousand skills, must find that ideal use and then shape the wood to realize its true potential" - George Nakashima

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