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Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

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  • Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

    I have the old-style Beaver 3400 with an MT2 headstock that seats the threaded MT1 adapter. Well, I need to get this spur drive out of the adapter, but it is REALLY stuck in there. I've tried heating it with a torch, banging on it with a nail in the divot from the rear, etc. but it's not budging. I want to bang on it harder, but I keep bending the nails I'm trying to use to drive it.

    My big question is this... on the Beaver MT1 adapter, does the hole for driving out the center allow access to the full diameter of the center, or is it one of those situations where there's a smaller diameter hole at the bottom of the taper where you can just fit a drift pin through. I want to move to a beefier piece of iron to drive the center out, but I'm not sure that it just won't be hitting the inside of the adapter, instead of the end of the spur drive. I can't tell just looking down with a flashlight.

    Also, any other tips for getting it out? I'd like to avoid penetrating oil in case I need to heat it again.



    This spur drive has got to go... for one, some of the spurs are bent, as you can see in the picture
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  • #2

    Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

    No there should not be a step narrowing out the bore, that would defeat the purpose of boring out the MT2 adapter. Put it in a vise,scrap wood faced, taper facing up and put a little penetrating oil or WD-40 in the socket and let it sit a while or overnight. The taper end of a MT 1 is .375 so a drift punch less than 3/8 say 1/4, should punch it out. This is an old design and the MT 2 should be threaded for a draw bar. If you want to use the draw bar, you should be careful not to damage the threads.

    Click image for larger version  Name:	MT2 to MT1.jpg Views:	0 Size:	83.4 KB ID:	1250580

    Edit: Heres a tip if the MT2 is threaded for the draw-bar and you have small bearing balls or something similar. Drop a bearing ball in the draw bar end or two. Screw in the draw bar or a threaded bolt the same size and using a wrench turn it in till the MT1 is forced out. Easier than pounding on a punch.
    Last edited by Carlosinthesticks; 09-10-2019, 10:56 PM.

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    • #3

      Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

      I've had the same problem for years with my 3400

      I'v often used a ball joint separator to drive the MT-1 out of the MT-2

      They come in different sizes ( I don't remember the size of the one I had ) so u have to find the right one for this specific job

      Click image for larger version

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      • #4

        Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

        some great tips to try already, here's a couple more.
        rather than holding the adaptor in a vice, thread on a faceplate and place it on a couple of bricks to use a knockout rod
        put the assembly in the freezer for an hour or so, then try the faceplate on bricks while heating the adaptor
        the key thing to remember is that a solid hit is better than a bouncy one, hence the faceplate on a solid surface
        my shop is a beaver lodge
        steve, sarnia, ont




        1940's Craftmaster Lathe

        https://www.facebook.com/artistryinwoodca/

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        • #5

          Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

          If you have a faceplate for it you should be able to use that to push the spur off as is common to remove a chuck from a drill press. If the back end is threaded fit it with a grease nipple and pump it full of grease. A grease gun puts out 10000psi, we use it to tension tracks on huge bulldozers.
          Rob

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          • #6

            Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

            Thanks for the tips all.I have been using the faceplate, sticking the spur drive through a dog hole in my bench and using the faceplate as a flange. No dice yet though. It still is quite bouncy, and I could drill it into my bench if I get desperate, but I would prefer to avoid that. I ended up blasting it with WD-40 last night, and I think I will try to get a high quality bolt from Spaenaur (don't want to shear it off!) and try to drive it off with a ball bearing, as suggested above. If not, I'll keep working the freezing/heating deal, but I'm a bit scared of warping.


            Originally posted by iamtooler
            If you have a faceplate for it you should be able to use that to push the spur off as is common to remove a chuck from a drill press. If the back end is threaded fit it with a grease nipple and pump it full of grease. A grease gun puts out 10000psi, we use it to tension tracks on huge bulldozers.
            Rob
            I thought about this, but there's no good way to grab the taper so that you can turn the faceplate, at least not without severely marring it. Also, the spur drive is the exact diameter of the faceplate bore, such that the spur drive comes to rest on the threads, and I think turning it would mash up the threads pretty well.

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            • #7

              Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

              [QUOTE=marinosr;n1250621



              I thought about this, but there's no good way to grab the taper so that you can turn the faceplate, at least not without severely marring it. Also, the spur drive is the exact diameter of the faceplate bore, such that the spur drive comes to rest on the threads, and I think turning it would mash up the threads pretty well.
              [/QUOTE]

              You would need to insert a washer with a cut out between the spur and the faceplate. You can grip the ruined spur rather than the taper. WD40 is not a penetrating oil! In any event there is no room in a self locking taper for oil to penetrate. You can actually use the threaded bolt to compress the grease instead of a grease nipple. Have you heated the adaptor cherry red yet?
              Rob

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              • #8

                Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                Here is a tool you can make if you need to do this on a regular basis, you will not need to hold on to a ball bearing. It is easily done with as little as a bench grinder. If you carefully size it you can also use it as a draw bar for the MT2 without popping out the MT1. The draw bar will prevent the MT2 from loosening and spinning inside the spindle which may score it.

                Click image for larger version

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                Edit: I didn't dream this up, it is the same principle used in the tailstock of most lathes to remove your tailstock center.
                Last edited by Carlosinthesticks; 09-11-2019, 01:00 PM.

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                • #9

                  Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                  Originally posted by iamtooler View Post

                  WD40 is not a penetrating oil!
                  Rob
                  Just because it dosen't say it in the name doesn't mean it is not. It works almost as well as my Keystone No. 1 penetrating oil and is a good alternative if you do not have dedicated penetrating oil. Soaks in and softens rust very well.

                  Oh, and don't go putting 10,000 psi behind it, if it suddenly loosens it will come out of there like a bullet.

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                  • #10

                    Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                    10,000 psi no problem as there is no compressed air to store energy. When the taper releases it may jump half an inch.
                    Rob

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                    • #11

                      Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                      I will agree to disagree again, there is enough initial energy when it pops to hurt you if your close, It looses that energy quickly because expansion does not continue after the initial pop.

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                      • #12

                        Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                        Looking at the taper, It looks like you can screw a faceplate from the end onto the threads, also use a steel faceplate, the cast iron ones that came with the Beaver are not strong and will very likely break.

                        The grease as a steady pressure does not work as well as an impact normally, but you have to make sure the taper/faceplate sits on something solid and hard, wood is not the best for this, a thick steel plate or something like a concrete block would be much better.

                        Use a good penetrating fluid and give it a couple days to work itself into it, you also need the thickest hard steel pin to fit into the opening and then a hard impact, or a couple, if you can get the wedge in tight between the spur drive and taper, plus the impact of a hammer, it would be best way to go.

                        Just adding this here, a machine shop might have chuck removal wedges, they come in sets and are made to remove tight fitting chucks (see picture), you could even make a set, they are quite simple, if you take some flat steel and drill a hole as big as the spur drive shafts then saw the piece out so it becomes a U, taper the ends with an angle grinder and it should do the job, some grease will help have them slide better.

                        Click image for larger version

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                        Last edited by Leo Van Der Loo; 09-11-2019, 03:53 PM.

                        Have fun and take care
                        Leo Van Der Loo

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                        • #13

                          Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                          if all else fails, the adaptor is replaceable. busy bee has mt2 pieces that can be threaded for the 7/8-14. youll loose the mt1 capability but that's no great loss
                          my shop is a beaver lodge
                          steve, sarnia, ont




                          1940's Craftmaster Lathe

                          https://www.facebook.com/artistryinwoodca/

                          Comment


                          • #14

                            Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                            Originally posted by stevem View Post
                            if all else fails, the adaptor is replaceable. busy bee has mt2 pieces that can be threaded for the 7/8-14. youll loose the mt1 capability but that's no great loss
                            Well, all else has failed haha. Pictured below is a 3/8" grade 8 bolt that I sheared off in the narrow end of the taper. :( It looks like this adapter is dead. I was trying to drive it off with a bearing. Driving it with a hardened dowel pin after heating didn't do anything. Looks like I'm going shopping. Steve, I didn't see anything like you mentioned on the Busy Bee website unless this is what you're talking about and I need to get it machined. I imagine that is going to cost a lot.

                            I've posted on the Swap Meet in case somebody has an adapter they will sell me. Fingers crossed!

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                            • #15

                              Re: Beaver 3400: Can't get MT1 spur drive out of the adapter.

                              Wedges as suggested by Leo , or a ball joint separator would do the job imho , nothing much to loose in trying them.Ball joint separator did the job for me during several years & when I sold my lathe I gave the separator to the buyer.Just insert between the 2 parts and give it a sharp snap w a hammer.

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