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Choice between 2 dust collectors

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  • La_Bizounerie
    replied
    Hi everyone! It was nice to read you all, very insightfull!! The 2 hp unit was "stolen" from me at the las second... I will not go for the 1 hp unit... will wait a bit and keep my eyes open for the next opportunity... thanks again!

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  • drzaius
    replied
    Good points about the quality of bag filters. We wired up a cabinet shop that had 2 50 HP blowers & a big filter housing with 40 or 50 bags in it. I remember that even after it had been in operation for a couple of years it stayed pretty clean in there, so those bags must have been working well.

    Then one day a machine malfunctioned & some burning embers made there way into the bag house. It was sprinkled, but the bags were gone by the time the sprinklers put the fire out. What a mess.

    Leave a comment:


  • altiplano
    replied
    Brian,

    You are no doubt correct that there are decent bag filters out there, but they aren't on any of the hobbiest dust collector models. These commercial shops probably also have proper ventilation and efficient separators with the collectors.

    My experience from a couple of years using a general international 1.5 hp model with what I think was a 2micron bag was nothing but disappointment and clouds of dust pouring off the collector even after it had a​​​​​ "cake" established on the filter.

    The fine dust coated my shop... everywhere, more or less all the time... it wasn't like that before I had the dust pump and ever since I got a cyclone with a canister filter that's gone.

    Anyway. Everyone can make their choice. But I'd rather sweep than go to a hobbiest collector with a bag again, it was counterproductive.

    Leave a comment:


  • John Bartley
    replied
    Originally posted by Brian @ Muir View Post
    I would like those that say the filter bags are of no value pay a visit to a few of the larger shops that do mill work or build kitchens. Living in the Woodstock area and visiting many shops in this area and London I have never seen canister filters in the larger shops. They all use filter bags that have to meet WSIB standards. To compare a filter bag that comes on a $400 Asian DC to the filter bags that are available from North American firms like Kraemer in St Catherine’s is comparing apples to oranges. I have had those cheap DC’s and every time you turn them on you get a cloud of dust. I have a Kraemer 5 hp DC and a Torit cyclone. I do not get the cloud of dust when I turn it on, woodworking is a dusty business and no matter how good you are going to get some dust escaping. I am not attempting to convince people not to buy canisters but we should not scare people who are starting out. I am sure a newbie reading some posts on this forum would shy away from woodworking thinking that woodworking without a canister will shorten his life.
    Brian
    I agree. I am in the camp that says that "anything is better to start with than nothing".

    That said ... I remember reading somewhere that part of the filtration comes from the fines themselves. As I recall, the article said that even in the cheapo collectors, after the first layer gets stuck to the inside of the bag, increasingly smaller particles fill the gaps and create finer and finer filtration until the reduced air flow indicates that cleaning is necessary. I know that I periodically have to take the top bag off my cheapo collector and give it a bath inside out. So ..... it may not be a $5k collector, but it's not bad for what I do. I think (for my purposes only) I'd be better to go with an air cleaner in addition to my cheapo collector than with a more expensive collector that takes up more floor space.

    Just opinion ....

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  • Brian @ Muir
    replied
    I would like those that say the filter bags are of no value pay a visit to a few of the larger shops that do mill work or build kitchens. Living in the Woodstock area and visiting many shops in this area and London I have never seen canister filters in the larger shops. They all use filter bags that have to meet WSIB standards. To compare a filter bag that comes on a $400 Asian DC to the filter bags that are available from North American firms like Kraemer in St Catherine’s is comparing apples to oranges. I have had those cheap DC’s and every time you turn them on you get a cloud of dust. I have a Kraemer 5 hp DC and a Torit cyclone. I do not get the cloud of dust when I turn it on, woodworking is a dusty business and no matter how good you are going to get some dust escaping. I am not attempting to convince people not to buy canisters but we should not scare people who are starting out. I am sure a newbie reading some posts on this forum would shy away from woodworking thinking that woodworking without a canister will shorten his life.
    Brian

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  • al.m..
    replied
    And a lot of old woodworkers did not have dust pumps excellerate get the fines into the air ,they used a broom

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  • altiplano
    replied
    Sure. But harmful affects of wood dust are well documented. I mean there's even more OLD smokers out there than old woodworkers, doesn't mean we dismiss it.

    ​But aside from that why get something that puts MORE dust into the air and spreads it around your shop? That just doesn't make sense.

    You're better with a broom and pan and its cheaper and quieter.

    Leave a comment:


  • RV Sam
    replied
    I would guess by now the OP has made up his mind and made the purchase or else the units got sold to someone else. I would just like to add that all the concerns for fine dust while true there are hundreds of thousands of OLD woodworkers still kicking and dead from other reasons other then sniffin' dust.

    Leave a comment:


  • altiplano
    replied
    I think a DC with a felt bag is worse than nothing at all as it keeps recirculating and pumping the dangerous dust into the air.

    All felt bags filter out are the non-dangerous chips and large grains that would just have fallen on the floor, while keeping the dangerous dust airborne.

    ​​​​​​

    ​​​​​​

    Leave a comment:


  • LaPedrera
    replied
    Originally posted by ErikM View Post
    Would buy the 2 hp and look at adding a canister and running a cyclone separator like an Oneida Super Dust Deputy to give effective collection for a single machine. I use a similar set up with a 5” flex hose that I can connect to the machine in use. The advantage is the whole unit cost not much more than $500 bought as used components and is quite effective for the price paid. The 1 hp unit is really not worth the money in my opinion and you would be better off looking towards a canister and cyclone for the larger unit.
    I would agree with this. I had a 1 hp DC with a SDD and it was miles ahead of a felt bag / cannister alone.

    Whatever DC you go with, the cyclone makes a huge difference.

    Leave a comment:


  • ErikM
    replied
    Would buy the 2 hp and look at adding a canister and running a cyclone separator like an Oneida Super Dust Deputy to give effective collection for a single machine. I use a similar set up with a 5” flex hose that I can connect to the machine in use. The advantage is the whole unit cost not much more than $500 bought as used components and is quite effective for the price paid. The 1 hp unit is really not worth the money in my opinion and you would be better off looking towards a canister and cyclone for the larger unit.

    Leave a comment:


  • al.m..
    replied
    Originally posted by smallerstick View Post

    I agree, it is a bit harsh. The 1 HP with a canister filter will drop a good bit of the dust and particulate from the ambient shop air. A 2 HP will drop even more. A shop without any DC is a very dangerous place. Better to begin somewhere and improve than just put on a mask and pretend you are safe. Some means of DC plus a mask is a whole lot better than a mask alone.
    of coarse both is better than nothing,but I recommended a respirator,not a mask. A nuicence mask,and any filter less than a hepa misses the harmful stuff,giving a false sence of security.
    so many of us have thrown good money after bad,and until you have a cyclone and hepa filer paired th the 2hp unit,your not getting the fines that are the issue.By the time you do have the cyclone and. Hepa,the cost is near what a decent unit will set you back,that's why I recommend appropriate ppe until you can afforded a quality unit,and even then,the ppe will still be useful.
    my 2 cents,I stand by it.

    Leave a comment:


  • smallerstick
    replied
    Originally posted by al.m.. View Post
    May sound a bit harsh,but
    dont buy both,don't even buy one,both are nothing more than dust pumps that will excellerate the most dangerous paticales into your shop.
    if you can't afford more,I'm sure you have a broom,buy a good respirator and use it and the broom and save for something better.
    I agree, it is a bit harsh. The 1 HP with a canister filter will drop a good bit of the dust and particulate from the ambient shop air. A 2 HP will drop even more. A shop without any DC is a very dangerous place. Better to begin somewhere and improve than just put on a mask and pretend you are safe. Some means of DC plus a mask is a whole lot better than a mask alone.

    Leave a comment:


  • al.m..
    replied
    May sound a bit harsh,but
    dont buy both,don't even buy one,both are nothing more than dust pumps that will excellerate the most dangerous paticales into your shop.
    if you can't afford more,I'm sure you have a broom,buy a good respirator and use it and the broom and save for something better.

    Leave a comment:


  • Stephan in BC
    replied
    If you’re going to be running a cyclone or Thein separator, 2 hp will really help with your separation efficiency. When I went to a 3 hp, my separation of dust became better than 99%.

    Leave a comment:

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