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  • Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

    Hi everyone,

    I'm shopping around for a dust collector for my new shop, and I've come down to choosing between two machines: the Felder RL 140 or the Clear Vue CV1800. I've read up quite a bit on both, including previous posts on this forum, and most of the time I'm leaning towards the Clear vue.

    Both have similar CFM, but the Felder seems to take up less space, it can be rolled around (good because I'm not exactly sure where I want it to go...), and the filters seem to be very good (.1 micron). The Clear Vue seems to have a good cyclone (extracts most of the dust) and work well, but I'm not sure if it's quite as efficient for the smallest particles as the Felder. It also takes up more space (height), and can't be moved easily. The other advantage of the Clear Vue is that it's cheaper. I can get a $1200 rebate on the Felder, but that still puts it at around $6K to my door. The Clear Vue comes in at around $4K. Neither are cheap by any stretch, but I don't plan on moving any time soon, and I do want dust collection that will filter out the fines as well as be able to handle a planer-jointer with no problems. I'll be sharing a space with my wife (who does ceramic), and I'll also be doing other stuff in the workshop like extracting honey, so having a dust-free environment will make things a lot easier.

    Any input is appreciated.
    Frank
    SPCHT
  • Thread Continues Below...

  • #2

    Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

    Frank, I am a ClearVue owner (so take my opinion FWIW). When I was shopping I concluded I wanted a cyclone with good separation. I had a single stage DC and was never going to go back to a single stage. In my research it came down to either Onida or ClearVue. Just looking at max CFM is pointless. You need to see the curve at different static pressure to see how the system performs in real world. You can get good quality filters (nano filters) for ClearVue. I can't figure out if the Felder is a cyclone (seems not) and if that's the case I have a hard time understanding the price tag on it. Even the Clearvue price you listing seems too high to me (looks like Stockroom supply sells it for $2500 with free shipping in Canada). You have to take into account ducting for any system you buy. I suggest you get the CV-Max.
    Remember, we are here to share, learn, and enjoy. Relax.

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    • #3

      Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

      ClearVue is just a copy design of Bill Pentz's. There definitely not very portable. But I'm sure something could be done to accommodate that. I built a Pentz clone. If I did it over again, I would use a three phase 5 hp motor and a VFD.
      For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
      Sir Isaac Newton.

      Comment


      • #4

        Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

        Thanks guys.

        Mo, the Felder is indeed a huge vacuum. I wasn't sure who distributed CV in Canada, so I asked CV for a quote to ship directly from the US. The price at Stockroom makes the CV look like a more obvious choice. Felder's strong point seems to be the filter, but apparently you have to clean it fairly often.

        Matt, I think B. Pentz licences his design to CV. I don't (or won't) have three phase in my shop. Why would you go with three-phase? Does the motor overheat? I think the CV max is a single-phase 5HP.

        Frank
        SPCHT

        Comment


        • #5

          Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

          My CFM measured hits close to 1900 on a 6 inch intake wide-open . Most of my tools, being a single Man shop only need 600 to 1200 CFM. I presently adjust blast gates at a predetermined location to adjust it for CFM . But the noise level of fan is still consistent. If I could adjust fan speed which would equal to required CFM with a dial down metre it would achieve two things, noise and consumption of amps. I'm not too concerned with amps draw and more with the noise.
          For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
          Sir Isaac Newton.

          Comment


          • #6

            Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

            Matt, I had never heard "I have too many CFM's".
            If the motor can handle the amp, dampen the sound (add a muffler or make a closet).
            Remember, we are here to share, learn, and enjoy. Relax.

            Comment

            • Thread Continues Below...

            • #7

              Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

              Originally posted by mreza View Post
              Matt, I had never heard "I have too many CFM's".
              If the motor can handle the amp, dampen the sound (add a muffler or make a closet).
              Too many CFM's cause my JP to go out of gravity affect in internal shrouding. Too many CFM glue board to the table saw and suck off cut back in into the blade. Too many CFM to the overhead guard, i've read it's Russian roulette, I don't have it yet(and when I do, I'll report). Most other applications, if the offcut is not substantial wood/would probably be OK.
              Last edited by Matt Matt; 10-05-2016, 11:59 PM.
              For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
              Sir Isaac Newton.

              Comment


              • #8

                Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                I have had a few times when small off-cuts were sucked up in the blade guard and hit the blade along the way; not funny!
                timberframe likes this.
                Remember, we are here to share, learn, and enjoy. Relax.

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                • #9

                  Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                  Originally posted by mreza View Post
                  I have had a few times when small off-cuts were sucked up in the blade guard and hit the blade along the way; not funny!
                  Me too with my Shark guard....wakes you up in a hurry!
                  Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club.

                  http://www.youtube.com/c/DovetailTimberworks

                  Comment


                  • #10

                    Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                    Originally posted by Frank D. View Post
                    Hi everyone,

                    I'm shopping around for a dust collector for my new shop, and I've come down to choosing between two machines: the Felder RL 140 or the Clear Vue CV1800. I've read up quite a bit on both, including previous posts on this forum, and most of the time I'm leaning towards the Clear vue.

                    Both have similar CFM, but the Felder seems to take up less space, it can be rolled around (good because I'm not exactly sure where I want it to go...), and the filters seem to be very good (.1 micron). The Clear Vue seems to have a good cyclone (extracts most of the dust) and work well, but I'm not sure if it's quite as efficient for the smallest particles as the Felder. It also takes up more space (height), and can't be moved easily. The other advantage of the Clear Vue is that it's cheaper. I can get a $1200 rebate on the Felder, but that still puts it at around $6K to my door. The Clear Vue comes in at around $4K. Neither are cheap by any stretch, but I don't plan on moving any time soon, and I do want dust collection that will filter out the fines as well as be able to handle a planer-jointer with no problems. I'll be sharing a space with my wife (who does ceramic), and I'll also be doing other stuff in the workshop like extracting honey, so having a dust-free environment will make things a lot easier.

                    Any input is appreciated.
                    I also thought the CV price seemed high....I think you may be able to do better. Have you considered the Oneida? They come with genuine certified HEPA filters and from the above it sounds like you're concerned about the fine dust. The Wynn Nano filters don't seem to be as good and when you go on the Wynn site they say they offer upgrades to HEPA too if you want, so they must agree.
                    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club.

                    http://www.youtube.com/c/DovetailTimberworks

                    Comment


                    • #11

                      Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                      Welbeck sells Oneida in Canada

                      Comment

                      • Thread Continues Below...

                      • #12

                        Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                        Thanks again guys.

                        I know next to nothing about DC. But there's the issue of efficiency, as far as I could tell, .5 microns filter at 99.997% efficiency vs .3 microns at 97% efficiency, etc. Not quite sure what to think. I looked at the Wynn Web site and from what I saw they were giving more of a warning against HEPA claims. Perhaps I wasn't looking at the right page. They said that there's no cleanable HEPA filter available in North America right now...

                        Mo, why do yo recommend the CV Max? I was thinking 8" pipe might be too big for nothing, I might have trouble reducing from 8" in the short runs that I'll mostly have. I was thinking 6" would be enough for me (one machine at a time). Again, I know next to nothing, so...
                        Last edited by Frank D.; 10-06-2016, 01:04 PM.
                        Frank
                        SPCHT

                        Comment


                        • #13

                          Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                          I thought about Oneida, but after having read various threads and reviews, CV seems to have a very good cyclone design. I trust Pentz, perhaps a little blindly, to have come up with a good design after all his research.

                          The one problem i have with all the "I'm really happy with mine" is that someone can be happy with it but the fine particles can still be passing through the system. I don,t want to be paranoid, but I'm looking for more than a DC that won't have mechanical issues. Of course there are usage factors like emptying bins and cleaning filters, but most of the good cyclone don't seem to have any major issues.
                          Frank
                          SPCHT

                          Comment


                          • #14

                            Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                            Originally posted by Frank D. View Post
                            Thanks again guys.

                            I know next to nothing about DC. But there's the issue of efficiency, as far as I could tell, .5 microns filter at 99.997% efficiency vs .3 microns at 97% efficiency, etc. Not quite sure what to think. I looked at the Wynn Web site and from what I saw they were giving more of a warning against HEPA claims. Perhaps I wasn't looking at the right page. They said that there's no cleanable HEPA filter available in North America right now...

                            Mo, why do yo recommend the CV Max? I was thinking 8" pipe might be too big for nothing, I might have trouble reducing from 8" in the short runs that I'll mostly have. I was thinking 6" would be enough for me (one machine at a time). Again, I know next to nothing, so...
                            The nice thing about HEPA is that it's a known standard. And you're not allowed to use the word unless it meets those standards, and any reputable organization should show you the certification documents. HEPA filters give you the expected performance when clean and new, not at some time in the future....maybe...when you've got enough cake built up.... Here's the corresponding page from Oneida that shows some results from independent labs of the various different filters.

                            http://www.oneida-air.com/static.asp...iltration.html

                            It also reproduces a review from a magazine that showed the Clearvue performing the worst of the sampled ones. So yes, it's on Oneida's web page, so take their writing as maybe a sales pitch, but many things on the page are not their work, just reproduced from others.
                            Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club.

                            http://www.youtube.com/c/DovetailTimberworks

                            Comment


                            • #15

                              Re: Felder RL 140 vs. Clear Vue CV1800

                              Frank, here are some comments based on my research/experience:

                              - CV1800 and CV-max use the same 5HP motor but the impeller sizes are 15 and 16" respectively. With the smaller impeller, the CV is only using around 3.5HP (or maybe 4HP) of the motor really.
                              The bigger impeller gives you more CFM and uses the full power of the 5HP motor. In order to get the full CFM of the CV-max you need bigger main run but even if you use a 6" main for Max I think you'll still get more CFM
                              compared to CV1800.

                              - Don't be too hung up on filter ratings. Get a good quality one and if you still are concerned you can make a closet for your unit (I've made one) and it dampens the sound significantly. Then you can put on one wall of the closet some good quality furnace filters (say 4 of them) as a 2nd stage filter for the return air. You get good quality filtering, you never have to replace the furnace filters (as they are meant to catch the tiny particles if there are any that leave the cyclone filter).

                              - Note that CV filter provides almost twice surface area vs Onida. That's a big plus (reduces SP and also more filter surface means less frequently cleaning).
                              Another plus factor for Wynn filters is the metal cage they come in. It is easy to hit the filter body for various reasons and I'd be really concerned about puncturing if there was no cage around it.



                              Remember, we are here to share, learn, and enjoy. Relax.

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