Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

    This is the DC I have 1.5hp 1200CFM. It has a dual 4" "Y" which I am going to cut off and just use a 6" inlet. I will replace the bag with a series 35 wynn filter. My question is: do I get the super duty Oneida which has a 5" outlet, or the bigger XL with the 6" outlet? Secondly, is there such a issue of going to large?
    I thought I read somewhere the XL is for 2-3 hp where as mine is 1 1/5 hp.

    Thanks,

    Click image for larger version

Name:	50-786 Delta 1 12 HP 1200cfm.jpg
Views:	186
Size:	19.5 KB
ID:	1267133
    Click image for larger version

Name:	bottom of DC.jpg
Views:	146
Size:	2.26 MB
ID:	1267134
  • Thread Continues Below...

  • #2

    Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

    I read this off the Oneida web site regarding a SD XL .....

    CUSTOMER REVIEW:
    Using a 2HP collector and 6" pipe I find that roughly 75% of the wood debris is collected in the barrel below the cyclone but having vented what I thought would be the fine exhaust outside the shop I find LOTS of heavy saw dust exhausted outside. The cyclone fails to collect enough of that heavy debris so much so that I'll be adding an additional collection barrel outside. Very poor performance.

    ONEIDA RESPONSE:
    Please try 3 HP – 5 HP dust collector as its recommended for this model


    On Amazon.com it says:

    for the super duty XL Retrofits to any make/model single stage dust collector (3-5 HP recommended). 6" I.D. inlet and outlet ports for use with common ductwork.

    For the super duty regular (Not XL size)
    Retrofits on 1 HP – 3 HP single-stage dust collectors. Approximately 24" height with 5" OD inlet and 6" OD outlet.


    MY TAKE ??
    Would the "XL" have too much draw of volume of air, thus not separating the heavier debris properly.......... or am I being to anal and way way over thinking this?
    Last edited by Dave Kor; 01-20-2020, 08:32 PM.

    Comment


    • #3

      Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

      I don't think that was Oneida's response, it looked like another reviewer commenting to "Steve"...

      Oneida states;
      Which Super Dust Deputy cyclone do I need?

      If your shop has fixed piping that matches the diameter of your dust collector's intake, choose a cyclone that matches that diameter as well. The collector's horsepower and CFM do not affect the performance of the different models.
      https://www.oneida-air.com/question/...one-do-i-need/

      There are lots of variables that could affect separation, people with poorly rigged setups, pipes going every which way, etc... but there are many people with successful installations of the XL with 1.5 HP systems. If you look online, youtubes, blogs, sawwmill creek, etc I think you'll see as many people with 1.5HP using SDD XL as 2-3HP using the standard SDD.

      I have a 2hp Oneida commercial now but right before I decided to go to a full cyclone, I was considering a SDD XL and a Wynn filter on a GI 1.5hp.

      Really I don't think you'll go wrong either way XL or 5"SDD. But I think the taller cyclone is better for separation... I think a 6" intake is better too, and future proofs you a little. I wouldn't get 4" inlets, you can adapt your 4" duct into a 5 or 6 inlet, but you don't want to go the other way reducing 5 or 6 into a 4" inlet. Smaller diameter duct further from the blower is generally acceptable getting smaller closer to the blower is to be avoided.

      I'm sure someone with experience with setting up their system may be able to direct you better on a model. I don't have direct experience with an SDD, only hours wasted reading the info and watching other people's stories online.
      Last edited by altiplano; 01-21-2020, 08:12 AM.

      Comment


      • #4

        Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

        I have a 2hp Craftex with cannister and the older steel SDD. Works good. It is piped using 5" pipe. I have read that using 6" pipe results in too low air velocity using these smaller blowers and you may have issues with larger chips dropping out in the stream and creating restrictions and blockages in your ductwork. I know even with the 5" my system struggles at the far end of the run and I had to clear a blockage on the run feeding my drill press which is farthest from the collector.
        Cheers
        Randy

        Comment


        • #5

          Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

          Call Oneida they are very helpful.
          Bob just past Ayr likes this.
          Jerome
          Canada's South Coast

          Port Colborne On.
          Every loaf of bread is a tragic tale of grains that could've become whiskey.......but didn't....

          Comment


          • #6

            Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

            Find a cyclone with a 4” port... changing up a size will get you nothing

            Comment

            • Thread Continues Below...

            • #7

              Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

              Originally posted by davezedlee View Post
              Find a cyclone with a 4” port... changing up a size will get you nothing
              Everybody says go bigger... this seems to be the opposite ideology?

              Comment


              • #8

                Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                Originally posted by Dave Kor View Post

                Everybody says go bigger... this seems to be the opposite ideology?
                Bigger the pipe, the lower the air velocity and the higher the risk of debris falling out of the airflow and clogging your pipes, especially around bends and Y's.

                For big pipe you need bigger machine.

                I think 5" main line for a 2HP machine is OK for a small shop with relatively short runs, at least based on my own experience.
                Cheers
                Randy

                Comment


                • #9

                  Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                  I have a 1.5HP Oneida cyclone.

                  The cyclone input is 6 inch, I use 6 inch pipe for the first few feet then drop to 5 inch mains and 5 inch branches (4 inch is too small for almost all branch runs).......As Randy indicated, you need to keep the airspeed up high enough.......Regards, Rod.
                  Work is the curse of the riding class.

                  Comment


                  • #10

                    Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                    Click image for larger version

Name:	image_136632.jpg
Views:	112
Size:	265.9 KB
ID:	1267223 Oneida's reply today on if I should 5' or 6"
                    With a 6” outlet on your Delta, you can use either the 5” or 6” SDD. The 5“ needs at least 350+ CFM and the 6” 600 to perform.


                    This retro on my DC is probably going to be 6-7 bills easy so I guess I better get this right. Would you guys mind giving me your opinion and if and what I should change.

                    I went down to 4" as my table saw is only 4' away and I'm using only 6 feet of 4" flex to saw port anyways,

                    Thanks
                    Dave.
                    Last edited by Dave Kor; 01-21-2020, 02:16 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11

                      Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                      Flex hose causes a lot of pressure reduction and restricts airflow a lot more than straight pipe. So I would keep the flex hoses as short as possible. The short pieces of 6" you have there shouldn't be a problem.
                      Cheers
                      Randy

                      Comment

                      • Thread Continues Below...

                      • #12

                        Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                        I have just added a SDD to my shop linked to a Delta 1.5 HP DC. I removed the 2 x 4" Y ad am using a 5" SDD to DC and 4" runs to the shop tools. The 45 gal drum is the best move I ever made, just so convenient. I use plastic drum bags as liners; pop the lid, pull out the bag and replace it.
                        So far, performance has been really very good. I get virtually no carryover from the SDD to the lower plastic bag. The only thing collecting there is fine dust from the top bag which gets knocked down and not very much of that at all.
                        Band saw, OSS and chop saw are on one wall, TS, jointer and a floor sweep are in the centre and the planer and router table are furthest from the DC. Pickup is good from all the tools
                        I hope this experience helps you a bit, good luck with your new system
                        The difference between a master and a beginner: The master has failed more times than the beginner has even tried.

                        Comment


                        • #13

                          Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                          Originally posted by smallerstick View Post
                          I have just added a SDD to my shop linked to a Delta 1.5 HP DC. I removed the 2 x 4" Y ad am using a 5" SDD to DC and 4" runs to the shop tools. The 45 gal drum is the best move I ever made, just so convenient. I use plastic drum bags as liners; pop the lid, pull out the bag and replace it.
                          So far, performance has been really very good. I get virtually no carryover from the SDD to the lower plastic bag. The only thing collecting there is fine dust from the top bag which gets knocked down and not very much of that at all.
                          Band saw, OSS and chop saw are on one wall, TS, jointer and a floor sweep are in the centre and the planer and router table are furthest from the DC. Pickup is good from all the tools
                          I hope this experience helps you a bit, good luck with your new system
                          Does the double Y 4" look anything like this?
                          Click image for larger version

Name:	Delta Port2.jpg
Views:	96
Size:	1.28 MB
ID:	1267271
                          Also what fitting did you replace the 4"er's with, and where did you get it, Thanks.
                          Last edited by Dave Kor; 01-21-2020, 07:53 PM. Reason: insert pic

                          Comment


                          • #14

                            Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                            I guess the question is: Can your system support the CFM to maintain required FPM in larger duct and meet Oneida's recommendation of 600 CFM.

                            Unless you test your own system it's a tough to say with certainty how many cfm you will get. Looking at a Delta 1.5hp DC specification, I see Delta rates it as 1200 cfm. I don't know if that's your model or not, you might want to check what they list it as... but either way 1200cfm is an exaggerated number.

                            Larger duct and a simple layout gives you a better shot to move more air. I think you reasonably could very reasonably expect 1/2 Delta's published number through 6" and a simple layout. Particularly with a cartridge filter reducing resistance on the back end. Perhaps someone here has tested theirs.

                            So FPM. Someone can check my math and I'm sure I don't account for something here.

                            Going by Bill Pentz's generally conservative numbers, 600 cfm would maintain adequate airspeed (600cfm/.196=3060fpm) in a 6" horizontal duct (>2800 fpm) ,but it would fall short on vertical drops (>3800 fpm). In 5" duct 600 cfm would be about 4400fpm.
                            ​​​​​​
                            Whichever way you go, a good recommendation is to have a few feet of straight duct run into your cyclone. This will smooth airflow and improve separation. If it were me I'd do that with the 6" (or if you choose a 5" model, I'd do it with 5"), then I'd do the first drop with 5" and then split the end to the 2 x 4" for your tablesaw.

                            As I mentioned, the 2 x 4" runs to your tablesaw should feed into a larger duct, or you aren't providing enough air to branch through both of them and maintain cfm and fpm.

                            ​​​​​Anyway... that's just my figuring, take it for what it's worth, and disclaimer again, I'm not an expert, just someone who has over thinks my own shop decisions along these lines too.
                            ​​​​​​

                            Comment


                            • #15

                              Re: Which Oneida Cycloine do I need

                              Originally posted by altiplano View Post
                              I guess the question is: Can your system support the CFM to maintain required FPM in larger duct and meet Oneida's recommendation of 600 CFM.

                              .....................................
                              Whichever way you go, a good recommendation is to have a few feet of straight duct run into your cyclone. This will smooth airflow and improve separation. If it were me I'd do that with the 6" (or if you choose a 5" model, I'd do it with 5"), then I'd do the first drop with 5" and then split the end to the 2 x 4" for your tablesaw.

                              ..........................

                              ​​​​​Anyway... that's just my figuring, take it for what it's worth, and disclaimer again, I'm not an expert, just someone who has over thinks my own shop decisions along these lines too.
                              ​​​​​​


                              Appreciate your help.
                              Does it matter if those few feet of straight duct are horizontal/vertical/ or on an angle?
                              The 1200 spec is probably right at the intake. I read somewhere that someone cut of out a re-stricter of sorts on the bottom of the squirrel cage, went from 2x4" to 1 6" inlet and his cfm's jumped up something like by 180 cfm's.
                              Click image for larger version

Name:	dust_collector3 (1).jpg
Views:	90
Size:	94.5 KB
ID:	1267279

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X